On Safety and Strumpetry: A Conversation with Luna Lapine - Securing Sexuality Podcast Episode 1210/30/2022
    
Securing Sexuality is the podcast and conference promoting sex positive, science based, and secure interpersonal relationships. We give people tips for safer sex in a digital age. We help sextech innovators and toy designers produce safer products. And we educate mental health and medical professionals on these topics so they can better advise their clients. Securing Sexuality provides sex therapists with continuing education (CEs) for AASECT, SSTAR, and SASH around cyber sexuality and social media, and more. Links from this week’s episode: 
Maintaining Privacy and Security in Adult Content Creation; Reclaiming Autonomy Through Sex Work
In recent years, the intersection of sexuality and technology has become increasingly prominent. With the rise of social media platforms, streaming services, and other digital technologies, more people than ever before are engaging in adult content creation. This type of content can range from explicit images and videos to more subtle forms of sexual expression.
While there are many potential benefits to creating this type of content, there are also risks that should be considered before taking part in it. In this article, we will explore the benefits and risks associated with adult content creation in order to help those interested in participating make informed decisions about their involvement. One of the primary benefits associated with creating adult content is that it can provide a platform for self-expression. For many people, exploring their sexuality through creative outlets such as photography or video can be a powerful form of self-expression and exploration. Additionally, creating adult content can provide an opportunity for individuals to gain financial independence by monetizing their work through various platforms such as OnlyFans or Patreon. This can be especially beneficial for those who may not have access to traditional forms of employment due to discrimination or other factors beyond their control. However, there are also risks associated with creating adult content that should be taken into consideration before embarking on this journey. One risk is that your personal information may become public if you do not take proper precautions when sharing your work online or signing up for certain services. Additionally, some platforms may require you to submit personal information such as your name or address which could lead to unwanted attention from strangers or even stalkers if it were made public without your consent. Furthermore, depending on where you live certain types of adult content may be illegal which could result in legal repercussions if discovered by authorities. It is important to remember that everyone’s experience with creating adult content will be different depending on their individual circumstances and preferences so it is important to take time researching different options available before making any decisions about participating in this type of activity. Additionally, it is important to ensure that all safety measures are taken when sharing any kind of personal information online as well as being aware of local laws regarding explicit material so as not to put yourself at risk legally or otherwise while engaging in these activities Overall, exploring one’s sexuality through technology has become increasingly popular over the past few years due its potential benefits such as providing a platform for self-expression and financial independence; however it is important for those interested in participating understand both the potential benefits and risks associated with doing so before taking part in any kind of activity related to adult content creation so they can make informed decisions about their involvement going forward Key Concepts: Sex Positive Art Collective Security Lead in Tech Industry Risk Profile for Adult Content Creators ID Verification for Adult Content Creators Privacy and Metadata Stripping Reclaiming Autonomy and Control Through Sex Work Open Source Intelligence (OSINT) Obscuring Identity with Venetian-style Ball Masks Ethical Sexual Content Production 
Hello and welcome to Securing Sexuality, the podcast where we discuss the intersection of intimacy and information security.
I am Wolf Goerlich. He's a hacker and I'm Stefani Goerlich. She is a sex therapist and together we're going to discuss what safe sex looks like in a digital age. Today we're joined by the amazing Luna Lapine, the self-described professional strumpet, I love that, and owner of Moon Rabbit Studios. Luna, welcome. Hi, I'm really happy to be here. Thanks for having me. Yeah, great to have you. Luna, you and I are Twitter friends. I adore everything you say and much of what you create that I get to see. And I'm super excited to be able to talk to you today, but I feel like you contain multitudes. So I'm wondering if we can start with you just telling us a little bit about who you are and what you do, because you do a whole bunch of different interrelated and separately cool things. Okay, that's a lot of high praise coming from you. You're one of my favorite people that I follow on Twitter, so big heart there. Yeah, so by day I am actually a security lead in the tech industry somewhere. I am by night, of course, the owner of Moon Rabbit Studios, which is a sex positive art collective that also dabbles in some business and security consulting. I also am an animal rescuer, avid animal rescuer. I have four guinea pigs that I spend a lot of my time with. Yeah, and I'm based out of Denver, Colorado. One of our favorite cities. It's great. I love it. So talk to us about your work at Moon Rabbit. Tell us about the art that you produce. Talk to us about the people that you produce content for. Who are your people? So my people are really anyone, all genders, all creeds, all whatever. Basically anyone who has an appreciation for something a little artsy, but also a little sexy and usually with a little bit of a dark twist because I am an unashamed goth. Big horror movie fan too, so a lot of that comes across too. Moon Rabbit Studios actually started, originally it was just going to be a way to cover my own art that I was doing. But then I started thinking about it and I thought to myself, you know, there's a lot of people out there who are of similar mindset as far as wanting to stick to things that were more artistic, things that are ethically produced. Maybe that have a hard time finding a platform or a studio that's willing to take on, I hesitate to use the word risk, but when it comes to comparing it to mainstream content, yeah, some platforms will consider it a risk if you're not just like everybody else. And I wanted to make sure that people who create all kinds of content had a place to come and do their thing. Obviously I'm not going to throw someone out just because they like to take their top off for photos. In addition, I also started thinking to myself that with my, I have a pretty long tenure in the tech and games industry and I've experienced a lot of things, I've learned a lot of things, done a lot of things that I feel like are very important for people in the digital age who are doing content creation and especially adult content creation to be aware of ways to keep yourself safe that you may not think about. It's very easy to get caught up on one part of security and not realize that while you're patching this hole, there's six other little tiny ones on this side. I want to make sure that no matter what people are doing, they're safe doing it and that it's accessible to them. They feel like they can do it. But I also don't want to worry anybody. So that's why I kind of, when I talk about security in regards to the adult content creation and keeping your identity safe, keeping yourself protected, I try not to be too alarmist, but I do try to be realistic. And that was one of the things that intrigued me about having you on as a guest, because I know you walk in both worlds. And this almost the spirit of this podcast is to describe how to be sexy and how to be safe, how to do security and be a hacker. And yet at the same time, enable intimacy. It's kind of strange, right? Because if you think about security, we're always talking about not being vulnerable. And if you think about intimacy, the intimacy begins with being vulnerable. So I was wondering if you could start at that point, right? What does privacy mean? What is vulnerability and the lack of vulnerability mean for you and the people you work with, considering you are so public on social media and on different apps? Well, I will say this. I have kind of bad news for everyone is that nothing is 100% secure. The good news is that you can get pretty high up there, but if you're expecting that, oh, I'm going to find everything and I'm going to be completely safe, there is such a thing as a risk profile. And it's something that everyone should have in their everyday life if they're going to be doing adult work, sex work, anything like that. But also if you're going to be setting up like your own app or having a web presence or anything, a risk profile is not something that you only use at say your local dungeon. You have to figure out what are you most afraid of? What are your biggest worries? What are your biggest concerns? How much are you willing to sacrifice in order to put yourself out there to advertise what you do to be present? And one of the things I sacrificed actually is that I don't have a social media presence as my quote unquote everyday self. I just don't exist on the internet. I don't have a Facebook. I don't have an Instagram, nothing. And that was something that I thought about because I realized that it would, especially nowadays, limit me in my ability to contact old friends, family, et cetera. But in the end, this was something that I wanted to do badly enough and I didn't relish the idea of someone putting two and two together, figuring out who I was and possibly using that information not only to hurt me but also to hurt family members, friends, my employers, et cetera, because unfortunately there are some people out there who will do that. So that's what I mean when I talk about figuring out what you're willing to give up. I do have my face out there. I could have just done everything from the neck down. I could have been very hush hush as far as my appearance, what I looked like, where I was. But with what I wanted to do, I really didn't think it was possible for me to do it to its fullest extent without putting myself out there a little bit. That being said, there are certain things that I won't do. For example, I won't travel out of state. I won't do in-person meetups anymore. I've done them in the past. But nowadays, especially with the pandemic, I just don't think that for me the risk is worth it. For other people, it may be worth it and more power to them. So what was that process like for you? How did you go about determining your personal risk profile? A lot of really, really deep thought. And I always jokingly say my anxiety disorder also helps a lot in those cases of trying to figure out worst case scenarios. It really did involve some soul searching. And it made me think about what my priorities were. What was most important to me? Was it my art or was it my presence as a figurehead in the tech community? And no matter what I do as a day job, I am always going to be an art kid. I am always going to be a theater kid. So that's always going to be where my passions lie. And being able to be that in my everyday life, which comes so much more naturally to me and so much more easily to me, but still being able to usher in what I'm doing with my day job, still being able to use a little bit of that to help others and to help myself, that really appealed to me. So that was a big factor in deciding to go the route that I did. So what does privacy mean for somebody who's public? You kind of did your own self-reflective work. You made your own decisions around where you wanted to prioritize your public facing self versus what you were keeping private. How does privacy look or feel different for you as a public figure? So privacy for me is a little more nerve wracking just because I'm not only keeping myself private, but as I said before, I'm keeping my friends and my family private. Anyone that I take photos with, for example, like say I go to a concert, say I want to take photos with a friend that's there. I have to make sure that that friend is okay with being in a photo with me, Luna Lapine, professional strumpet, just because not everyone has an alter ego. Some people are just themselves and they don't get into the adult creation or anything themselves. And they may have reasons that they can't or don't want to be associated with that. And I don't take offense to it because I understand that sometimes we've got jobs that if we get seen in a photo with someone who's a known burlesque performer, it's going to go badly for us at work the next day. It's one of those things where I love taking selfies, but I like getting a paycheck more. And I think everyone should probably prioritize that to some point. Another thing that I have to worry about is keeping my location private. I am in Denver. I never mentioned what part of Denver. I am very careful when I take photos outside that I make sure that there's nothing identifiable in the background. I make sure that all metadata for those photos is stripped out before I post it anywhere. Thankfully, social media platforms like Facebook and Twitter, they do that automatically. Others like Instagram, which don't allow direct download of the file anyway, kind of mitigates that risk. The worst somebody could do is a screenshot, but that's not going to have the original metadata. It's sort of a way of figuring out what are the most likely ways that my location, my safety, my actual identity, I sound like a superhero here, what are the most likely ways that those are going to be compromised? And basically, you start there and you work your way back as needed. And hopefully, you never need to worry about any of the really offbeat situations. I've had to deal with stalkers in the past. It's not pleasant, but it is another thing that has to be at least in the back of your mind. While there's a pretty good chance you're not going to have to worry about that, if it does come to pass, what are my plans? How am I going to keep myself safe? And so first off, I love that comment. I was chuckling about the superhero side of things. That really appeals to me. Professionals trump it by day and by night. In regards to things like Instagram and social media, great point about the photos and the metadata. That used to be a thing that we are all very concerned about. What about some of the other sites that you work with? So for example, I recall seeing some of the things on the socials about Patreon. Yes, Patreon has been a main character on Twitter for the past few weeks. The news story for anybody who is tuning in and is unaware, they fired their entire security team. They issued a statement a few days later stating that they were relying on the, from what I read, they're relying on the in-house security teams from the third party providers that they work with to basically keep them safe. The scary thing is that they announced this and this all came out about firing the security team and such right before they were going to start requiring ID verification for adult content creators on their platform. Now websites like OnlyFans, Fansly, et cetera, they already do this. So anyone who's got an account on those websites already knows what it's like. You have to submit your ID, your ID, which by the way I should mention probably has your date of birth, possibly your social security number, your address, all sorts of personal information, a photo of you if you're one of the people that does the no face shots. And the fact that they went ahead and did this while the very next month planning to require this not insignificant piece of information about all of their adult content creators who I hate to say it, but given the mentalities of some people in the world these days are already at higher risk of having to deal with some of these less than savory situations. Plus their attitude that they've had towards adult content creators in the past. There's been a lot of reports and I've experienced it also myself of some undue harassment being held to standards and guidelines that they claim apply to everybody, but when you go back and read their terms of service they actually don't. The community team just seems to decide how they want to apply it and who's allowed to follow the regular terms of service that are posted on the site and who has to follow this nebulous one that seems to only exist in people's heads. It doesn't instill a lot of faith in them as a platform, at least in my case, and that was also part of my risk profile was looking at the money that I was bringing in from Patreon, looking at the audience that I was building there, was it worth risking my data, was it worth risking my own safety to continue there? And I decided that with the degree of risk involved in this, having seen in my time in the tech industry what can happen when security is a last priority or assumed to be handled by someone else, I decided that for me I wasn't willing to take that risk and I understand that that may look different for some people. They may decide, oh, but I'm bringing in $1,000 a month on this platform and that's a substantial part of my income or all of my income. I get it, you have to do what you have to do, but it's something to be aware of and that's a really powerful thing you can have is awareness, knowing what's going on with all of the platforms that you have your content on, that you post on as your alter ego or even as yourself. Again, if there's photos of your face as one and photos of your face as other, there is a chance that someone can reverse image search and figure out who you are. So to that point, there's an app that has come to my attention, Only Bands, that teaches people what to post and what not to post. How does that technology, how do those information and resources influence your decision making, particularly around your interactions with clients or fans or consumers of your art? Well, I'm actually going to have to check that website out because I have somehow missed this, but thank you for telling me about it and thank you for mentioning it because it sounds like a really valuable resource. There are very few out there that are targeted towards people who are sex workers, people who create adult content. So it's fantastic to hear that there's someone else out there who's worrying about our safety and whoever runs that site, shout out, you are in my heart. I think it's something that more people need to be aware of that it exists, that it's something that they need to consider. I personally love reading up on articles written by sometimes other sex workers. Sometimes it's just by people in the tech community who care about us, who care about their fellow humans and say, hey, by the way, there's a possibility that this could be used for nefarious purposes. I pour over the security news, who's doing what, what platforms are adopting which policies, just kind of sitting back and sometimes thinking about a way that I've produced my content or given my content to the public at large and thinking to myself, could I have done this in a way that was better? It's always sort of iterating on basic security and then continuing to learn what the best way is to do that going forward. If you can go back and maybe edit what you've already done to improve your safety there. But the thing to realize is that once you post something, say you forget to strip your metadata before you post something to a personal website, well, the problem is that even if you get to that an hour after it's posted, the worry there is that in that hour, how many people have accessed it? How many people have downloaded it? And of those people, how many of them are interested in looking at your metadata to figure out what kind of device was used to capture the image, where you are? As a matter of fact, there's, that's not just paranoia. There was a tool that was put together after the January 6th insurrection at the White House. It was a wonderful tool. Somebody actually took the time to go through and scrape the metadata from posts on Parler from people who had been proven to be there. And using the location data, they were able to use a map to overlay where these things were uploaded from, thereby giving people an idea of where clusters of, I mean, these dangerous people possibly were living, working, spending a lot of their time. And in that case, I mean, I believe that was used for good personally. But it could be used for nefarious purposes also. Think about if it's, you know, it's very easy to get the metadata. As a matter of fact, if you have Adobe Photoshop, you can open up an image and you can actually view and edit the metadata there. Imagine if somebody wanted to make like a sex worker tracker. If someone wanted to go through and say, oh, hey, here are all of these hot cosplayers. Let's make a map showing where they upload most of their content from using this data. It's terrifying. It's really terrifying. You have to be on your guard. You have to, if not on your guard fully, you have to at least be thinking three steps ahead. So that's terrifying, as you said. It feels overwhelming even to listen to. And I don't want this to feel heavy. I don't want people who might be considering sex work or sex performance to feel discouraged or afraid. I mean, obviously this is work that you love. So I want to kind of pause in the midst of the dystopia and just ask, what do you love about what you do, Luna? What about your work keeps you engaged even when all of these other issues are on the table? Oh, so much. Honestly, so much. I mean, enough to make it worth considering the dystopian futures and presence, as it were. For one thing, the freedom. I love being in charge of myself, being my own boss. I love running Moon Rabbit Studios and having the ability to take on the projects that I really am passionate about and want to do. And I really, one of the things where I get the most inspiration for the stuff that I do is actually old Victorian era cabinet cards and postcards of the erotica sort. They had some really neat stuff back then. But it's the ability to be able to chase that down and bring that to other people to share my passion with them, to introduce people even to it when they say, oh, wow, where did you come up with the idea for this? It's a little bit of a knowledge share almost actually. And if no other reason, it gives me an excuse to deep dive into it. Say at Halloween, for example, if I want to do a month of horror themed shoots, well, guess who gets to crash on the couch and watch shutter for a little while trying to figure out what I want to do with that. And when I say freedom, for me, attempting not to make it heavy again, but I have some pretty horrible stuff in my history that was done to me in the context of being forced into sex work when I was not wanting to do it. And it strikes people as funny that so many years later I would go back to it. And honestly, for me, this has been a way to reclaim myself, to reclaim my autonomy and to say, I'm doing this my way. I'm doing this my way this time. This is my body. I present it the way that I want to present it. I tell people who I don't want to have access to it to go on their way. I'm not obligated to deal with people who make me feel unsafe, who make me feel disrespected. So it's sort of seizing back that control after it was taken from me was so liberating. I'm glad that I took the plunge and tried it. And I was ready to decide, oh, no, this is too much. This is too triggering for me. I need to just stay away from this. But I took the plunge and I feel like my mental health and my self-confidence has honestly never been better. What do you like about your clients? Oh, I have met some of the sweetest and most interesting people. I mean, of course, I've met some people who aren't so great, but the vast, vast, vast majority of them, they're just, they treat me like royalty. They adore me. They make me feel so appreciated. You know, it's amazing, actually, looking 10 years ago at the mentality towards sex workers. It still has a ways to go. But I find by and large, far more people are willing to treat you like a human being or better now than they were in the past. And it's one of those things where now people care what you have to say. People care about the person who's putting on the costumes, who's dancing on stage, who's meeting them for dinner and a night in. It's a good feeling. It's really a good feeling. And it helps because there are so many people who still want to dehumanize us. It really helps counteract that. And so I'm very grateful for all of my clients. Everyone who's even given me a dollar, everyone who's taken the time to interact with me, everyone who's taken the time to retweet or reblog or share. Thank you so much. Thank you even to the people who just say hello. I appreciate it. I really do. You know, one, you're talking through that. I'm reminded Stefani, who was the person whose image was used for image compression algorithms and everything? What was her name? Oh, Lena. She was a Playboy centerfold with a European name that I can very rarely ever pronounce. Lena Söderberg with an umlaut that I know I'm destroying. But I think about that, right? So like so many of us saw Lena's picture being passed around the internet for so many years in the early days. And you don't stop and think like, what was she like as a person? What did she care about? What was her art? What was her reason? And so I completely agree with you. I think we've seen a sea change and a shift in being much more engaged with people these days, which I love. I like that a lot. The other thing is those Victorian images, again, Stefani, I was thinking about some of the things that you've been sharing with me recently, right? Bringing some of that art back, bringing that some of that art and imagery to life is really, really intriguing. Well, thank you very much. I'm glad to be able to bring it back to people. And kind of a weird fact about me that's semi-related. One of my favorite things to do is to go to antique shops, flea markets, et cetera, and find the abandoned ancestors, the photos that no longer have names attached to them. And in the case of these cabinet cards and postcards, unless they're popular models of the era, which there are a handful, many of them have been lost to time. And I feel like in a way, by taking inspiration from their work, by posting the sources, by introducing people to what they did long before I took the reins and started trying it for myself, I feel like I'm bringing them back to life almost. And I hope that doesn't sound too arrogant, but I think about if it were my photos and no one was left to mourn me, would I want someone to do the same? And I think I would. I think I would be honored wherever I was in the ether at that moment. I think that would really be wonderful. So I hope that I've done that for someone of yesteryear who paved the way for what I do now. I love heading into fall, into Halloween. I love that so much. I was reading a lot of excerpts from Victorian Bravo guides when I was doing research for my latest conference talk and the little snippets of personality that come through, right? The name and bubbly and friendly and enthusiastic or very well skilled at the art of insert fetish of choice here. I love that. And the idea of being able to perhaps not accurately, but spiritually put faces with those names is lovely. And now I want nothing more than to set up like a Victorian sex worker, of friend, which you and I will have to collaborate on. That would be super fun. I want to make that happen at some point. Everything you say is really hitting my heart and it's wonderful. I love it. I'm so glad to find a kindred spirit on there. A lot of times people look at me like I've lost it. When my son was little, we used to go to Cracker Barrel on Saturday mornings to get the good French toast with the pseudo real maple syrup. And one of the games that I would play with him to keep him occupied is to point at the pictures on the wall and say, tell me who that is. And he would say, I don't know. And I would say, but what name would you give them? And I would have him describe their life and make up a story for them. And it was a lovely way to kind of connect with history and also make time pass faster. I love it. That sounds wonderful. You know, there's a power in names and they say that really we die twice. Once when we depart the world and once when somebody says our name for the last time. So I think that does very well with that sort of view of things. That's wonderful. One of the things I wanted to ask you, Luna, was the duality of tech. You're in tech, you see this all the time. And every time we invent a tool, it can be used for good, it can be used for bad, it can be used to enable and get the message out, it can be used to track people down. And likewise, some of these things like the metadata components and some of these things like looking at people's information can also, I'm sure, keep people safe, right? So if I'm going to meet someone and maybe I want to look up who they are, what's going on or those sort of things. Is there is there positives towards all this information we have out there in your world? Is there ways that you're able to get a glimpse into the people you're working with or the people are going to meet with in a way that increases safety and increases experience? Oh, absolutely. And like you said, it is that duality. It's that double edged sword. I actually in my network, I have someone who specializes in doing OSINT, that sort of reconnaissance on other people, usually when people have behaved poorly in managing to gather evidence and such to be used in trials, to be used in restraining orders, police reports, etc. So that's one application of it, honestly, is you can turn it around and you can keep yourself safe by saying, aha, I have all of the receipts. Always keep receipts, folks. Let me just sidebar you on that. Always keep the receipts. And as we continue, I mean, it's 2022. We've all been living online mostly for the past three years. So I expect that these tools are only going to get more powerful, more in depth. And it's up to us to use our powers for good instead of evil, I suppose. But again, I'm really grateful that there are people like her out there. Am I allowed to give her a shout out? Of course. Okay. Her Twitter handle is locked down your life. That's you are not spelled out. She really does some amazing work and she really has just restored safety and security to a lot of people. And while I hope that, of course, someday this will be something that we don't need to worry about in the meantime, it's wonderful that we have allies like her out there that are really keeping us safe. She's been very helpful also in making some security recommendations to me. She's a joy to talk to. She's just a joy to work with. So hi and thank you for everything that you do. It's a great shout out. You know, and that leads into probably one of our last questions together as we're running out of time. So for people in relationships, right, for people who are trying to keep it fresh and sexy, for people who may be sharing content with only a small number of folks, those sort of things, what type of advice do you have for them? Like how to keep content safe and yet still be intimate? Well, for a start, I would say leverage the power of the internet and social media. Again, OnlyBands was the website that you mentioned earlier. Sounds like a great resource. Follow some people who are in infosec, some who even tend more towards the sexy side of things. Follow them, see what they're saying, food for thought type thing to keep in the back of your mind. Also something to keep in mind is that there are plenty of people on fansly, OnlyFans, et cetera, who do no face content. The trick there being that if you have any easily identifiable marks, tattoos, et cetera, you know, that may still not be enough to keep you safe. You may have to slap a bandaid over it or something. But you're not required to give up your security and your privacy in order to do this. There are ways to do it. You are not less of a creator just because you don't want to show your face. And another thing that I've seen done for obscuring identity, which I think is hot as hell personally, those Venetian like ball masks. Oh my God. There is something about those that is just so beautiful and elegant and sexy. It's just like, every time I see someone employing those either solo or as a couple, it's like, oh, hello, I could watch this all day. I would say don't, I know I said at the beginning that I try not to scare people and I'm really afraid that I've scared some people. I'm always happy to help answer questions either publicly or you can email me. There are so many people out there who are willing to do the same. PrawnSec is another one that is a great resource for people who are doing adult content creation and want to stay safe. Don't be discouraged. Worry but don't worry if that makes sense. Be vigilant, be smart, be conscious. Think about each platform that you decide to put your content on. But if you just apply a little bit of common sense and maybe sleep on it for a night or two before you decide to hit the upload button, I think you can really do some incredible things. I have just one last question related to that before we move towards our farewells because I could talk to you for another half hour, 45 minutes. The sleep on it before you post makes me wonder what response would you have to the people out there that say it's not worth it or it shouldn't be happening or people should not be creating adult content? What is your answer to the naysayers that would say this can never be safe enough to be possible? Well, the first part of that, I absolutely, I mean, I am adamant that no one should feel pressured or forced to do this. So if it's not for you, it's not for you and that's okay. Don't feel ashamed of that. There's nothing wrong with that. But where it crosses the line, in my opinion, is when you start shaming other people for making that choice as adults, consenting adults to explore the side of their sexuality and their interests and passions. I certainly hope that the people who think this way have never in the heat of the moment decided to let their significant other take photos of them or video of them and that that never ends up anywhere because honestly, that is also a consideration is that some of the people out there who are adult content creators are actually victims of revenge porn. And obviously, you're not going to see that as much on the mainstream sites, but there are some pretty unregulated Wild West sites out there where that is a real concern and not that anybody should be shamed for making the conscious decision either. I mean, stay out of people's bedrooms, stay out of people's business, but keep in mind that when you make sweeping declarations like anybody who makes adult content or takes a nude deserves what they get, you're really victim blaming quite a bit there. So take a deep breath, realize that honestly, if you don't want to see adult content out there, don't look at it. You don't have to view it. It's fine. And maybe try to apply a little bit of kindness and a little bit of empathy and remember that it could happen to any of us. And if you do want to view adult content, pay your content creators. Please. One of the best ways to access ethical sexual content is to pay the people producing the sexual content you're viewing. That's my soapbox for this episode. Luna, is there anything that any final thoughts you have, any soapbox you want to jump on before we wrap up for the day? No, I think we've covered it all. And it's like I said earlier, it's great to sit here with a couple of kindred spirits on all this. It's great to have someone taking in what I'm laying down. That's absolutely wonderful. And I'm really glad I was able to talk to you and talk to everybody listening. So excited that you could be here. Thank you so much. It's been a great conversation. And where can people go to find out more about you, Luna? The main place that you can find me is either on Fansley, Luna Lapine. You can look me up there. Or you can find me on Twitter and Instagram. That one is XOLunalapine. In general, if you see that handle anywhere, it's almost always going to be me, one of the two. Unfortunately, there were a few platforms that someone already was using the name Luna Lapine and then abandoned the account. Tear. I also have a main sort of biographical website with all of my links is LunaLapine.com. No spaces, spelled just like my name. That'll let you know everywhere that I am. Fantastic. Thanks again. And thank you so much for tuning into this week to Securing Sexuality, your source for the information you need to protect yourself and your relationships. From the bedroom to the cloud, we're here to help you navigate safe sex in a digital age. Be sure to check out our website, Securing Sexuality, for links to everything Luna, for more information about the topics that we've talked about here today and for information about our 2023 conference. And join us again for more fascinating conversations about the intersection of sexuality and technology. Have a great week. Thank you. 
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