Securing Sexuality is the podcast and conference promoting sex positive, science based, and secure interpersonal relationships. We give people tips for safer sex in a digital age. We help sextech innovators and toy designers produce safer products. And we educate mental health and medical professionals on these topics so they can better advise their clients. Securing Sexuality provides sex therapists with continuing education (CEs) for AASECT, SSTAR, and SASH around cyber sexuality and social media, and more.
Links from this week’s episode: Unmasking Revenge Porn: Insights on Content Removal and the DMCA
In today's digital age, the internet has become an integral part of our lives. It has brought countless benefits and opportunities but has also given rise to new and disturbing threats. One such threat is revenge porn. Revenge porn refers to the non-consensual sharing of intimate images or videos of individuals, typically by former partners, to cause harm or embarrassment. This malicious act has severe consequences for the victims, including emotional distress, damage to personal and professional relationships, and potential legal ramifications. Here we will explore the rising threat of revenge porn and discuss practical steps to protect yourself in the digital age.
Understanding Revenge Porn: Revenge porn is a form of cyberbullying and online harassment that has gained significant attention recently. The internet has made it easier than ever for individuals to share explicit or intimate content, and unfortunately, some people use this as a weapon against their former partners. The motivations behind revenge porn can vary, ranging from a desire for control and power to feelings of anger or revenge. Regardless of the motive, the impact on the victim can be devastating. Legal Perspective: Revenge porn is not only morally wrong but often also illegal. Many jurisdictions have recognized the need to address this issue and have enacted laws to criminalize revenge porn. The specifics of these laws can vary, but they generally make it a crime to distribute or publish intimate images without the consent of the person depicted. It is essential to familiarize yourself with the laws in your jurisdiction and understand your rights and legal recourse if you become a victim of revenge porn. Protecting Yourself: While the responsibility for revenge porn lies solely with the perpetrators, there are steps you can take to protect yourself in the digital age. Here are some practical measures you can implement:
Revenge porn is a growing threat in today's digital age, causing significant harm to its victims. Understanding the nature of this threat and taking proactive steps to protect yourself is essential. By establishing clear boundaries, being mindful of your digital footprint, and utilizing privacy settings and security measures, you can reduce the risk of falling victim to revenge porn. Remember, the responsibility for preventing and combating revenge porn lies with society as a whole, and it is through education, awareness, and legal action we can work towards eradicating this alarming trend. Key Concepts:
Stefani Goerlich: Hello, and welcome to Securing Sexuality, the podcast where we discuss the intersection of intimacy-
Wolf Goerlich: -and Information Security. I'm Wolf Goerlich. Stefani: He's a hacker. And I'm Stefani Goerlich. Wolf: She's a sex therapist. And together, we're gonna talk about what safe sex looks like in a digital age. Stefani: And today I have questions for Wolfgang. Wolf was traveling a bit this week, as I'm sure all of you will be shocked to hear. Wolf: Hey! Stefani: I mean, I think they'd be more surprised if we told them you were home for more than 48 hours at a stretch. But while he was gone, a colleague from the world of sex therapy reached out to me about a situation somebody in their world had encountered where their images were being posted online without their consent. Not sexy images. Nothing that you know would fall easily or neatly under the category of revenge porn or nonconsensual sexual material, but some fully clothed and yet still potentially problematic pictures have been posted on various places online, and this person has been contacted with what seems to be some vague sort of blackmail-ish threats trying to keep this general and anonymous while still kind of at least shaping up why this is on my mind today. So, the question that was posed to me was, how do we get this stuff taken down? How do we get these pictures that are being shared without permission off the Internet? And I mean, I'm not a hacker, but I know enough about the Internet to know that the idea that something can be removed entirely from the vast spectrum of the Internet is probably not accurate. But we can sometimes have things removed from specific places or websites, which brought me to the thing that is called the DCMA - DMCA.. Which is it, Wolf? Wolf: Which letters is it for the Digital Millennium Copyright Act? DMCA. So, DMCA was another one of these bills that was passed in the late nineties. It was another one of these things that was well-intentioned and has worked OK in some ways and has caused problems in other ways. It was one of these things similar to, you know, past laws that we've talked about that happened in the nineties when a lot of folks were getting online. And there's a big concern about, uh, copyright. There's a big concern about what's gonna happen when anything can be just downloaded or uploaded. And so this is the foundational law, uh, which some folks can use to remove content. Generally, it's used by, you know, big companies who are like, Hey, get this video off right We've all went to YouTube and the video says this video has been removed before blah, blah, blah, blah, because the person who posted it included too much of a particular clip or too much of a segment. And then the organizational and the copyright requests are removed. So there is a, uh, way to remove content, and usually that content is removed by large companies. Um, but to your to your case, first off, before I get into some of my questions does, does that answer what you're you were looking for? Stefani: It does. I think that the context in which I'm most familiar with this is usually during election cycles. Right where where I hear about this law is when some politician, uh, uses a song from an artist that does not support said politician. And the artist says, Hey, stop using that. Take those videos down that that's usually where I've heard that before. This is often in the context of like music protection, not just fair use, but also sort of like ideological. I don't want my art or my music or my image shared in that context. And so they leverage the DMCA - I now know - to enforce those rights. Am I understanding that correctly? Wolf: you are, and you mentioned fair use. Fair use is one of the things that the DMCA has come under fire for, right? Like, um, is this chilling fair use? Is this being used to shut things down? Uh, you and I were in a lecture in Boston a little bit ago and one of the things that the presenter did, they shared a clip or they shared a video that was made up of a series of clips and one of the things they made a point of is each one of those clips was so small that it passed DMCA filters and passed fair use so one of the pushbacks. And you'll see this, like from the EFF and others, Uh, on the DMCA is that it does jeopardize fair use and one of the counters of that as well, maybe we're redefining fair use as we go along to ever smaller clips. Stefani: You know, I actually want to stop and mention that the talk that you're talking about specifically I think, is really, really important. And I want to find that video and share it in our show notes, because we were at the speaking of a whole bunch of letters - the National Center for Victims of Crimes – National Training Institute, which is also connected to the National Crime Victims Bar Association sort of annual meeting and training. So, um, I was presenting along with a good friend of ours there and one of the talks. The talk that you mentioned was actually the father of one of the Parkland, um, shooting, um, victims. And the video that they created was, um, a a gun violence awareness video That was incredibly powerful. And they had wanted to do a Super Bowl ad, and everybody kept saying, That's ridiculous. That's insane. There's no way anybody will afford it. Nobody will donate the money to do that. There's absolutely no way you can leverage the Super Bowl. Heck, we're not even supposed to use those words without permission from the National Football League to promote your cause or your story. And he took that and what he ended up doing was you're right. Using just words like individual one or two. I think they set a three-word limit, Um, from the Super Bowl ads from that year. And they made this amazing collage video out of the Super Bowl ads. And I think that not only is that such a brilliant way to navigate these sort of fair use, free speech, copyright protected images, um, conversations, but also such a powerful purpose that I wanted to just pause it and give the context for that, and I will if I can find the video. And I'm sure I should be able to put it in the show notes, because I think it is a phenomenal example of, um, how people wade these waters and still manage to stay true to what they're trying to do. Wolf: Yeah, I, I think on the you know, we always think about technology, pros and cons. And the same thing can be said for laws on the pro side of this. Uh, the restrictions, of course, led to interesting ways of thinking about things, right? Creative constraints lead to creative people, Uh, on the con side of things, there's a lot of folks who had to try a lot of things to figure out whether or not fair use applied. Uh, and there's certainly been some pushback against the DMCA in terms of, uh, stifling competition or stifling innovation around any number of technology products. So, yeah, the example that, uh, that you give is well taken. Stefani: What about the stuff that we do want stifled, though, if if my picture And I mean I'm I'm a writer. I am. Have you know, a pretty prominent public persona At this point, I don't consider myself a public figure, but I have a public presence. If somebody were to take something, I share a selfie of you and I on instagram and use that somewhere else. What can I do? What if if I were in a situation similar to this person. I was speaking to this week. Um, how does the DMCA or anything else protect me there? Wolf: Well, in this you you said the magic word there. And I, uh the magic word is selfie, uh, and why selfie is a magic word other than the fact it's a fun word. Um, is because the DMCA protects the copyright owner who owns the copyright of a photo. And if it is Hey, we were, you know, long distance, and I took an image of myself, and therefore I wanted to to share that with my partner. And then at some point in time, that photo got released. I own as this selfie taker, that photo. Now, I seem to remember you telling me and this story is a while back when we were first dating, Actually tell me about the habits of some folks where, um, they would be having relationships. They'd be, you know, getting it on. And the the man would be taking the photos with the girl's phone, and then the girl would review the photos and share the ones that she liked or approved with him. Do I got that right? Stefani: You have? Usually. I mean, most of the times when I was hearing that context, it was less about, um I'm gonna say content approval. I mean, people are are taking, uh, sexy time pictures of one another. They're probably less concerned with, like, the clothing piece. But, you know, making sure it's flattering. Make sure I'm making sure I like the lighting that I'm comfortable with. That angle that, you know, if I'm, um, more self-conscious about one part of my body versus another my tummy versus my butt that, you know, I get to say which of the pictures you've taken. I find the most flattering and then share from there, and that's true whether they are erotic or whether they are posing at the zoo in front of the new baby Hippo cage. Everybody wants their best face put forth publicly where they can. Wolf: When I took you to the baby Hippo cage, did you put your best face forward? Now I'm very curious. Stefani: I wanted to pet the baby hippos. I didn't know, but I was concerned with how I looked. It because I'm certain I looked over-eager and excitable and probably I don't remember exactly which pictures you took of me in that moment. But I suspect they were mostly the zookeeper trying to hold me back from petting one of the most dangerous animals on Earth. Because you did. We went to the San Diego Zoo and we got very close to the hippos. And I did get to meet, not a baby. It's a little bit bigger than a baby hippo. Baby Hippos look like adorable, cuddly potatoes. This was like a teenager, a teenager potato hippo. But yes, um, you were taking pictures and I was distracted, so I don't know that I got fully informed photo-sharing consent in that moment. Wolf: Well, I like this example that you've taken us to because I feel much more comfortable talking about this. All right. There is a website called Revengebabyhippo.com and revengebabyHippo.com is all about letting people post photos to get revenge, uh, with, uh, with their partners and friends in the context of baby hippos. And, um, there's a couple moving pieces here. Right? So that revengebabyHippos.com. The website, uh, is protected by Safe Harbour. Uh, there's a safe harbor provision with the DMCA that says, You know, if you're just if your members are posting things or removing things. We've talked about this in previous episodes. Um, you cannot be held accountable as long as you are not the one who's driving that content. So DMCA has a carve out for safe harbour. So the the website owner of revenge baby hippel dot com You you can't necessarily go after them Now they have to take action based on takedown requests. So if there is copyright law, they are responsible for taking action on that, but they're not held responsible for the content itself. If that makes sense, the second thing, If I took the photo of you and, um, you then later find your you're overly excited rushing the baby hippo cage trying to scramble over top of it while three, zookeeper hold you back. Photo posted on revengebabyhippo.com, You know, like, No, this is not That was supposed to be just for me and my loved ones. What are you doing? And you may think that you can take it down because it's a photo of you. However, if I took it, I own the copyright. So one of the first questions that I had for you when we're having this conversation, uh, around this case, consult was who took the photo? And you don't need to answer that. But I'm saying, just in general, for anyone who's going through this process, was it a selfie or was it someone else? Because the person who took the photo under the DMCA is the person who can file a takedown request. Stefani: And I think that's important to know, because it doesn't seem intuitive to most people. Most people are going to say, But that's my face. It's a picture of me. I own my face. I own my image, Um, and yet it's It's not. Your image is not yours unless you created the image of your image. That was something that, um, the Supreme Court ruled on when I was a survivor advocate that, um, you know, there was a case around upskirt photos, people walking to and from work, people walking around and, um, primarily guys, I'm gonna use guys here, um, taking pictures of their skirts and dresses on the sidewalks. And it went all the way to the Supreme Court. And the ruling was that if you are in public, you have no expectation of privacy that if you are walking down the sidewalk in a mini skirt or if you are, um, so excited you're trying to climb into the baby hippo pen to cuddle the tiny potatoes. Um, that if that's a public zoo, if that's a public sidewalk, whoever takes a picture of you is allowed to do that. You don't own your face. Whoever creates the image of you owns that image of your face or any other body part. Wolf: Yeah, exactly. And your point about men and women is well taken. So, uh, a couple of statistics, uh, nearly 90% of the time the victims of these are women, and the, uh, perpetrators are men. And in 2023 in August, which is just last month when we're recording this, the revenge porn helpline. Revenge Porn helpline is a helpline that's run by a, uh, global nonprofit uh, SWGFL is the nonprofit that runs it. The Revenge Porn Helpline reported its highest rate of calls since it's been operating since 2015 and reported a 30% increase since July. So not only is this is this largely women, um, but certainly we're starting to see an uptick in men, and I'll get to the differentiation in just a minute. Not only is this largely women, but it's also, at the moment, a trend that's very disturbing in terms of going up and up. Stefani: I'm curious, and I don't actually know if there is an answer for this or not, but, uh, in the world of domestic violence, sexual assault, one thing that is not uncommon is that sort of reverse uno approach by abusers. We see that now with, um, defamation lawsuits by perpetrators of abuse towards their victims, who say ‘I have been abused,’ and I'm curious if there's any information about, uh, particularly, you know, I'm thinking of our sex work community, our survivor community in In kinky spaces, people trying to warn other people about predators, about bad actors who have, um, these laws weaponized against them. If there are not cases of perpetrators out there saying, How dare you put me on this list saying I'm a perpetrator, That's my picture. I want my picture removed from that gallery of bad clients or that list of abusive players in a given community. I can't imagine that we can find statistics broken down that way. But given the way that the anti-discrimination and the defamation laws are being weaponized against survivors right now, I'm curious if some of the sort of community safety standards that we're seeing developed might not be harmed by things like DMCA laws. Wolf: It might be I don't I don't have any statistics or stories around that. But I I could see that happening. I think one thing that is interesting is back to the gendered side of things. Um, revenge porn tends to be a, uh, a male perpetrator and a woman, uh, victim. The opposite side, which is sextortion. So this is where you take a photo and you, you know, um, try to blackmail someone from that. The opposite is the sextortion side, which is we are seeing a uptick in that being, uh, men as the victims. So think about this, like catfishing. Or think about this. Like, um, you know, you're on one of these websites, like grinder or whatnot, and someone tries to get you off the website and gets you to exchange a photo and then tries to use that against you. These types of attacks. So we're starting to see more of the sextortion side, uh, against men. So, um, I don't know, kudos for gender balance, I guess. I don't know where to take that from that. But it is. It is interesting to see how this action can be weaponized differently, depending on what people care about and depending on the monetization side of the criminals. Stefani: Yeah, that is a conversation that I have had more than a handful of times, especially with my male clients. Um, they will be talking to somebody online on a dating website, usually on a hookup website. Um, sometimes the person identifies very directly as a sex worker. Other times it's more implied that it's going to be a one-night stand or a casual hook-up. And the request is made, um, send me a picture of yourself holding your license that way I know you are who you say you are. That way I can be confident that you're not catfishing me and so that I can share that with my safety contact my safety call person before we meet up. And, you know, from a risk-aware, consensual behavior perspective in a digital age that makes a lot of sense. I mean, we tell people, you know, before you get into a car with somebody for the first time or on a first date, you know, take a picture of their license plate, shoot that to a friend. We're very security aware these days, which can be a good thing. But in a lot of these contexts, the person making the request is not acting in good faith. They are not actually going to meet up with, um, the person being asked for a picture. They are not going to have a one-night stand. They are not a working sex worker. It is a scam because they can make a lot more money getting that one picture and blackmailing you not to share it with the world as somebody that is into whatever you're into or who was going to purchase sex from a professional. Um, you know, that can be a far more profitable Endeavour than the actual sex work can be. And so we have people that are being, I don't even wanna say catfish because it's not necessarily that the other person is a false persona. They're just simply using the framework of hookups or of paid sex in order to get material that is far more valuable as extortion material than it is as, um, a point of entry into a sexual encounter. And having those conversations and talking about the risks of that with my clients has been an interesting one. Wolf: Well, and I think you offered a really good framework on how to, um, identify the vulnerability in your SquadCon talk - the one that we did a couple episodes ago. Uh, and I and I bring that up for a couple of reasons, one so that you could explain how that worked, but secondly, let me give the numbers for it, and then you can give the context. In a study published in the journal Victims and Offenders. This study looked at, uh, 20 & 21 and they surveyed 2000 Americans, Right. So 2000 Americans during the height of the pandemic. Um, this number is what surprised me because you think about things like sextortion, you’re like, Yeah, I think I heard someone talk about that one time. Like maybe that's happening. But a lot of us who, uh, would face this would be like, I'm not telling anyone about it. And as you know, one of my big proponents about cybersecurity is talk about when these things happen. Talk about what happened. I know it's embarrassing. Uh, but share it because if other people hear your stories, they'll be more aware of what the criminals are doing. They'll be, you know, more likely to fend it off. So with that in mind, um, out of 2000 Americans as a percentage, how many people do you think got sexstorted? Stefani: Um oh, this is like that fun. How many people get sexually assaulted? Game. I was playing with my class over the weekend. Are you looking for the number? I think it really is or you looking for the number I think we know about. Wolf: I'm looking for the number that would have been reported in this, uh, journal entry, right when Americans were surveyed. What did they say? Stefani: Ok, I am going to stick with my, um, sexual assaults and exploitation is some of the most under-reported crime awareness information. I am going to say that, um, for my University of Michigan class, we were talking about how for every 1000 sexual assaults, only 344 are reported. But those are more physical and can be more, Um, take a deeper physical toll on the person. So I think the online exploitation and assault is going to be less so I'm going to say, out of 1000 let's cut it in half. I'm gonna say 172. Wolf: You're you're not that far off. It was 7%. So out of 1000 that would be, what, 70 people. So you're well within. You're well within a confidence interval for sure.Um, so that's we're we're looking at close to one in 10 people. And again, this is something that a lot of people think it happens to someone else, maybe, and sometimes that happens about one in 10 people. And again, according to the survey, uh, men were twice as likely to report it as women. Stefani: Do you think that that twice as likelihood report comes because of the difference in victimology or the difference in the nature of the crime? A man is more likely to perceive this as a financial crime, meaning somebody tried to get money from me. Whereas a woman is more likely to experience this as a sexual crime. Somebody's trying to violate me. Somebody's trying to humiliate me. Wolf: I don't know. It's a really good question. Um, but in terms of ecology, it reminded me of what you're talking about in terms of loneliness and how that opens people up to these types of attacks. Stefani: Absolutely. Um, there is this perception that people are dating online. Um, I know that I talked about this at Las Vegas and SquadCon. I'm not sure how much of that you shared with that episode, but one of the things that was most startling for me is, you know, even as a sex therapist who spends a lot of time talking to people that are dating. I always assumed that online dating was way more prevalent than it is, but actually only, like 30-something percent of people say that they've dated online at all. Or that they've used dating websites at all. And only 10% of those people actually met their partner online. So I think that there's this misperception in what is socially or culturally expected to share. I think people that might be more hesitant to share information with somebody they're chatting with through a dating website or a social media platform that they might, you know, ignore that internal warning sign because they're thinking that this is just the culture. Now this is the norm. This is how we do it. I just need to get used to the way people connect and date these days, when the reality is, that's still not the majority of how people are dating. And I wonder if that sort of cultural distortion around the importance of online connections is inspiring people to share sensitive photos or more personal information that they wouldn't necessarily share if they were having that same conversation at a bar or at a Social mixer of some kind. I mean, I've never ever went – back when I was single. Definitely not now. But I think people know you would. You would, um, be displeased. But back when I was single and I was talking to somebody in person, never once did somebody go. I'm really enjoying this conversation. Can you show me a picture of yourself naked? It doesn't happen in real life, but on OKCupid or plentyoffish or tinder or grinder, that's pretty normal. You know, we've been talking for a half hour. Can I see a picture of you naked? And I think that the distorted idea of how common online dating is might encourage people to share things that they wouldn't share in other contexts. Wolf: So I'm about to break one of the rules of statistics. So any of our statistician listeners, uh, I apologize, and you can send hate mail to me at JWGoerlich. But let's assume that original study of 2000 folks, let's assume 30% of them were using dating sites, right? Which is the stat you just used. Let's assume 7% of them, uh, were a victim of the scam. we've now went from one in 10 Americans to one and four. So the prevalence is a lot higher than I think a lot of people think about. But if you are taking those selfies thankfully, thankfully, the only good side about this is you can use the DMCA to issue a takedown. Um, there are, you know, certainly DMCA.com has a you know, a form. And, uh, you know, we will be happy to take your money to issue it. There are also lawyers who will get involved. You can go through a family court process. Uh, really depends on your state. I'm not a lawyer, So don't take my legal advice at all. Uh, but you can consult a lawyer and then I did mention the, uh, revenge porn helpline which can help you depending on, um what country? What nation? What state? What region you're in, uh, can help you navigate the local laws, and hopefully, um, use some of these, uh, some of these legal instruments to get your information removed from online. Stefani: Are there other things people could be doing to kind of head this off at the pass to keep their photos or their information from getting out to begin with. Wolf: Well, and this is one of the things that frustrates me. If you're like, Hey, how do you stop and not don't do this? Um, the advice is like, be cautious about what you're sharing. Um, you know, think before you act, uh, make sure that the people you're in relationships with are really people you're in relationships with, uh, you know, seek support of your friends. Part of the problem is I mean, yes, that's good advice, but it gets back to that. Just don't do it. And, uh, maybe that's the answer. Maybe Just don't do it. Uh, But if you are wanting to share these pictures, um, if there is a good reason for you to share this picture, certainly be aware of these scams. I think that's that's phase one. Take it yourself. Phase two. So you own the copyright. Um, but, you know, sharing these photos and tips and advice for safe sharing of photos is probably an entire other episode. So, yeah, just be aware of the scam. Be very conscientious. Be very careful. Uh, especially if people are trying to get you off these dating sites immediately and to something else. That's usually a pretty good indicator. They're trying to bypass some of the controls and these dating sites, and just be careful out there, folks. And if it happens to you, don't don't feel that you're alone, because again, this is happening at a greater rate than we thought. Stefani: And I think that, you know, don't be too quick to go off. The platform is important because, you know, Facebook or some of the other dating websites, uh, have algorithms in place that if somebody asks for, you know, can I see your driver's license? The words license will pull up a message saying, Are you sure you know who you're talking to? I know on Facebook, whenever I'm mentioning, um, books, it'll be like, Careful. Are they asking you for money? Be sure you know them, and so they're starting to build in sort of these. I can't even say guard rails, but reflection points. And so it behooves the people to move you away from those reflection points. Um, but yeah. I mean, this is a part of risk-aware, consensual, anything. There is nothing that is perfectly safe. It is unreasonable to say that we should never share our lives or our experiences on public platforms. It's just a matter of thinking about what you are comfortable having out there. And before you take that picture or send that image think about you know, if this were to end up somewhere, I can't control it. Am I OK with that? And maybe maybe Baby Hippo cuddle time. You're OK with being released into the wild world of the Internet. But maybe the sexier selfie or the, um, personal license identification you would not. We can't protect the absolute safety and prevention of all sharing, but we can think carefully and reflect on what in each choice we're comfortable with and act in alignment with our own personal risk framework. Uh, thank you so much, my love for taking a minute to explain this to me in the context of hippos and selfies and revenge porn and everything else. I appreciate you letting me pick your brain today. Wolf: Yeah, of course. And to the listener. Thank you so much for tuning in to securing sexuality, your source for the information you need to protect yourself and your relationships. Stefani: Securing sexuality is brought to you by the Bound Together Foundation, a 501(c)3 nonprofit. From the bedroom to the cloud. We're here to help you navigate safe sex in a digital age. Wolf: Be sure to check out our website, securingsexuality.com for links to more information about the topics we've discussed here today, as well as our live podcast, our live conference. We should do a live podcast, too. Now. Think about it. Our live event in Detroit, which you can get tickets to using the code POD15. Stefani: And join us again for more fascinating conversations about the intersection of sexuality and technology. Have a great week. Comments are closed.
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